Free Discussion, August, 2014

Please use this for Duggar and Bates sightings, speculation, or general discussion. Note that this is Duggar discussion not other families, TV shows, politics, religion, or personal stories. If the comment is more about you or some other issue than the actual Duggars or Bateses or other families seen on the show, please rethink before sending. Thank you!

419 comments:

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Anonymous said...

I agree that "accepting as many children as God sends" does NOT equate to feverishly "trying to conceive" every possible month. That is unbalanced and they seem to believe in a lot of balance as they have stated.. Once again, a contradiction of their belief system and lifestyle. It is also unhealthy for a woman to constantly be "knitting a new human being". Her body needs time to recover and rebuild her own nutrients, something they don't allow to happen.. so not wise.

Anonymous said...

I have watched the duggars off and on for the past few years and really just "dawned" on me how the behavior of JB and Michelle is totally self centered. Michelle seems to display attention-seeking behavior with the constant pregnancies. i really feel that is what it is.

It is a shame that the young girls are not allowed to live their life other than raising every baby that pops out.

Wampascat said...

So true! As we can plainly see, Michelle is the incredible shrinking woman. Can't imagine how brittle and bird like her bones are by now after having the calcium sucked out of them by all of those blessings.

AddiMom said...

Just saw a pic of Kelly Bates in her MOB dress on the Bates website. She is WORKING the aisle! She looks great. Want to snark, but nope, nothing there.

Anonymous said...

It seems to me that the Duggar family has completely gotten carried away with the fame of being "reality stars". A new "season" of shows for a family that doesn't even watch TV is pretty telling of where their priorities are.

Anonymous said...

I still say Michelle is a narcissist. Literally everything is about her. From the opening line of "and yes, I delivered every one of them" to the girls doing all the work, to J Boob swooning over "mama" all the time. The pregnancies and/or wishing for pregnancies is an attention-seeking behavior for her, the baby talk shows us how cute she thinks she is, the whole thing is just gross.

Anonymous said...

I was wondering..... did Josh decide on a home birth for Mack (at the last minute) due to the fact that Dr. Served was on vacation and the doctor on call was a male?

Anonymous said...

Interesting point about the deliveries always being done by females....??? Hummmm....these people are really off their rockers.

Anonymous said...

It hadn't occurred to me before that the women aren't "allowed" to have a male gyno/ob. But, of course, I should have known.

Anonymous said...

Why did Josh decide on the birth events? That should have totally been up to Anna. I'm sure the gender of the physician was the most important concern considering the one hour ride to the midwife and Anna's uncertainty of making it on time. That was a stupid decision whoever actually made it. They truly don't show any concern for their wives well being ever. The only one who is treated like a queen is Michelle and she loves every minute of it at the expense of her own daughters..

Anonymous said...

It's really shows the hypocrisy of the Duggar family. Women aren't suppose to work, yet they only use female obstetricians/midwives. If fundies take over the government, who will deliver their babies and medically treat their wives and daughters?

Nancy Ann said...

Anonymous, you are using WAY too much logic for the Duggar/Gothard world by asking who would deliver the babies if everyone followed their beliefs. Plus, the Rapture will come and take them away before things get really bad for them. That's why they don't worry about world-wide catastrophes. The rest of us poor sinners will be here dealing with it and they will be whisked away. (Unfortunately, I grew up listening to this).

Zoey said...

I'm wondering, if they are all so sheltered, how come they (older kids) are so into social media? It doesn't seem to be the natural progression of technology to know nothing about the internet except religious propaganda to being an Instagram and twitter expert.

Anonymous said...

That's a very good point about their hypocrisy. When Jim Boob went to the allergist wasn't that a female doctor? Was Michelle defrauded because the female doctor or the woman (who did the needle test on his back)touched him?
Or in the episode when Josie was shown in the incubator shortly after her birth with perhaps only a premie diaper on, was that immodest?

Alberta Rose said...

Given that the high risk pregnancy OB they saw was male, given that they've been to male dentists, and given that there are secular women who feel more comfortable with a female OB/GYN to help deliver their baby than a male OB/GYN, it seems like it's a non-issue. Also, midwives are traditionally women.

Anonymous said...

RE: The question bout Josh deciding the last minute about a home delivery when Anna was in labor with Mac. Yes, that's exactly what happened. DR Sarver was on vacation, so that's what Josh decided. Now you will hear the explanation from both Josh & Anna that, "everyone" was out of town. What they mean by that is, DR Sarver was out of town & the Duggar family was at Big Sandy Camp in Texas. JB sounded shocked on the phone when Josh said they were, "considering" a home birth (Anna was in labor). JB told them to pray about it & of course, he put Michelle & Jill (I think) on a plane & they arrived just as she was about to deliver. Why they did a 2nd home birth for Michael is anyone's guess, but Anna was in the worst pain I've ever seen anyone in, screaming for help, she really was in agony. That's when Josh decided he needed a nap and went in to take a nap. I'm not sure if there was so much flack about what Anna went through with Michael, but for some reason they decided to have a midwife with Marcus. I haven't heard Josh & Anna mention DR Sarver since their first pregnancy.

Willow said...

I think Kelly Bates had a male doctor when she finally had to switch her deliveries to the hospital. She introduced him on an episode (don't remember if it was a Bates episode or a Duggar episode). I think she had many deliveries at home but then had some sort of complication and switched to the hospital for the last few. At any rate, my point is that, as usual, the Bates SEEM to be a little more reasonable about some things.

The point about who will do things if fundies take over the Govt? I had the same thought. I see the extreme fundies as only being one step away from polygamy and berkas. That may seem a little extreme, but I mean, really, if their men were to get a lot more power, they would want to do something with that power, i.e., take it to the next step (maybe). Just something to think about.

Anonymous said...

I have a feeling that Dr. Sarver has had enough of the Duggar "three ring circus" and told them to take their "birthing" business elsewhere. As for Michelle seeing a male high risk OB....he took a blood test.... how invasive is that! If he had done an internal exam we would have seen the exam door being closed on the camera crew!!!

Anonymous said...

I'm re watching the proposal episode and really realizing how many things just don't add up in even this episode. How could Jill not have known he was going to propose! He calls her for a date weeks beforehand to ask her for a date while she's out of town. Wouldn't that have been a given that she would see him once she got back? Just as it would be with Jessa & Ben. I highly doubt he FaceTimed her while out signing books to ask her on a date. Then Derick says he asked specifically for Jana & Joy to be chaperones. I'm pretty sure that it's not usually the guy who picks the chaperones so definitely another hint that a proposal was gonna happen that day. Then Joy says in the interview that Derick had only called the night before to ask them to chaperone the date. Wasn't there a rehearsal? So how did he only call the night before?

Something else I'm curious about. Who pays for the chaperone to eat when they have a date? That's certainly a lot more money the guy has to have just to date a Duggar daughter or any women that follow this style of dating with a purpose.

Alberta Rose said...

Midwives do not take on a client at the last minute. They do work with doctors. Some women, regardless of belief, will see both a midwife and a doctor, with the midwife being the primary and the doctor being the secondary. Home births and unmedicated births tend to involve more traditional reactions to labour contractions, which means there will be more screaming, moaning, grunting, more motion, and positions that may seem weird to those who favour the shut up, dope up and obey Mainstream Society birthing method.

Leigh Ann said...

And with Marcus' birth, Anna kept crying "please God, don't let my baby die". I don't think she wanted a water birth. Water labor, maybe, but she was scared to death her baby was going to drown. I think she was forced into having a water birth. I felt so bad for her. She's the one who's supposed to get exactly what she wants in childbirth (barring some complication that results in something unwanted like a c-section, of course). She'll never put her foot down and make sure she gets what she wants, though. Josh, and possibly the midwife, know best, of course.

Anonymous said...

Re: the Amount of screaming, grunting, moaning mentioned,that all happened when Anna gave birth at home to Mac. But it was very obvious that Michael was a whole different story. Her intense labor was for over 20 hrs. & apparently the fact that he had an extremely large head was a major problem. When Michelle & Jill arrived for Michael's birth, Michelle kept saying how beautifully Anna was doing& she knew Anna would deliver within the next 15 minutes. Eighteen hours later she still hadn't delivered. I don't care about screaming, moaning, grunting,
positioning & repositioning. A woman in her own home with no certified midwife and over 20 hrs of labor needed some help. For Michael's birth, Michelle was there, Jill, the DR's wife(don't remember her name) that isn't a certified midwife, but is a doula (doulas don't deliver babies)that teaches birthing classes was there. However, there was no certified midwife or medical personal for Michaels birth. If I had been a member of the film crew I would have called 911!

Anonymous said...

I can't believe it. There is a huge difference between what an OB/GYN does as opposed to a Dentist.

Londonbridges said...

A male dentist and a male OB-Gyn are like comparing apples and oranges. Their job description is very different. I won't go into details, but to compare them is just not right, in my humble opinion only.

Ginger said...

I find the comment about those who favor the;shut up dope up,& obey Mainstream Society birthing method, to be an extremely offensive comment.

Beth Anne said...

Re: the shut up, dope up and obey Mainstream Society birthing method

I've seen plenty of unmedicated births both on video and live to render an opinion that Anna's delivery of Michael seemed exceedingly agonizing to her. I also think it's a little insulting to separate all birthing mothers into two categories: The "Good" Natural Birthers like Anna and the "Bad" Medicated Birthers. There's a range of birthing choices, and sometimes things change. With my first one, his cord was wrapped around his neck (which we didn't know until post delivery), and despite all my efforts to remain calm, switch positions, and do deep breathing, I would still "stress" with each contraction, which tightened the cord, which caused his heartbeat to come to a halt, and it was horrible. I was seconds away from an emergency c-section, but was able to receive a dose of pain relief that relaxed me and my body enough that the cord loosened enough that I was able to proceed with a vaginal delivery. The very experienced doctor, who had delivered thousands of babies and was near retirement, said it was the best pain relief intervention he'd ever seen :)

I just feel like people within the Duggar circles have this mindset about the way a birth "must" be done and Anna was/is scared to deviate from that course, because any type of pain medication is "evil." She would not be any worse of a mother, in my opinion, if she had had taken pain-relief medication during Michael's delivery.

Anonymous said...

I find the comment about those who favor the;shut up dope up,& obey Mainstream Society birthing method, to be an extremely offensive comment.
>>>>>>>>>

Me, too, Ginger! I am a fan of natural birth. I have had several natural births - even a water birth of a 10 pound boy. I had one c-section due to PIH and breech. I even had two at a free standing birth center with state licensed midwives with master's degrees in nursing.

All that said, every woman has the right to have the birth she wants. I want the ability to choose and others should have that right. A woman who can't fathom going through labor with no pain relief has the right to choose. A good practioner allows women to do that.

Yes, c-section rates are too high. Yes, some docs may allow women to choose one out of convenience but that is not all doctors. Shut up, dope up and obey is a very harsh and extreme prejudice in my opinion!

Anonymous said...

One of my big issues with fundies is black and white thinking as we've seen here. Things are right or wrong, good or bad, biblical or not biblical without much thought or analysis. They can't comprehend shades of gray or nuance.

Judy said...

The cornerstone of extreme religious thinking is not to question and to be very black and white and feel very logical even though it is completely illogical. You start questioning and you lose your followers.

Anonymous said...

I believe that John David and Joseph came off as somewhat arrogant and superior this past season. Who are they to give advice on marriage and relationships!

sandi said...

Anon at 7:54,yes Jill did say she knew Derick was going to propose,she just didn't know when.That is what invited the comment about if she saw 'the bulge in his pocket' (the ring box,) it would give it away.

sandi said...

Re: to those who favour the shut up, dope up and obey Mainstream Society birthing method.

----------------------------------
That is not the only other option though.I had 2 epidural births,and wasn't drugged/doped up at all.
I think it's sad Anna wasn't given that option.

sandi said...

Re: The point about who will do things if fundies take over the Govt? I had the same thought. I see the extreme fundies as only being one step away from polygamy and berkas. That may seem a little extreme, but I mean, really, if their men were to get a lot more power, they would want to do something with that power, i.e., take it to the next step (maybe). Just something to think about.
---------------------------------

That's the way I feel about it as well.Women would be plunged back into a previous century,if they have their way about it.JMO

Anonymous said...

RE: The comment about Michelle & JB seeing a Male, high risk OB/GYN For God sake's all he did was take blood from them & warn them that another pregnancy, regardless of the results of the blood test was fraught with every danger imaginable with both the pregnancy & the health of the infant; i.e Downs Syndrome,other life threatening illnesses or chronic birth defects. Then there was Michelle in a talking head segment, saying she had been told about all those possibilities before. Why then was she so very surprised at the miscarriage of Jubilee? She just admitted she was warned about these things & yet she acted like she was the first mom ever, who was taking her vitamins, exercising, eating well (I question that) & yet experienced a miscarriage. Lets be clear, Michelle, you had a miscarriage with Jubilee, not a stillborn, or such an early delivery that the baby couldn't survive. They couldn't even tell the gender of the baby at that point in the pregnancy. Certainly wasn't a devastating & unpreventable "crib death," that so many wonderful parents have experienced. Those have nothing to do with the age of the mom.Michelle & JB are always talking about what they went through with Josie's birth, but what about Josie? That baby suffered something awful with needles everywhere various "minor surgical repairs," that were never explained. I know Josie is here & apparently a healthy happy child & that's wonderful. But who knows what lifelong effects she will still suffer from? We'll never hear that. Enough, Michelle!JMHO

Anonymous said...

I agree with the "black and white mindset". This family thinks that we should dress like them or we are tramps in "daisy duke shorts" and midrift bikini tops. You either court like they do, or you sleep with every boy/man you date. There is no room or belief that moderation exists, which is so wrong of them. They need to be sat down and listen to the other side of the modesty coin and realize that we are NOT all having rampant sex outside of marriage, some of us can date and NOT include sex before or outside of marriage just fine, thank you.
It is called being mature and having self control and the personal ability to keep yourself within your standard belief system, "when no one is watching". This phrase seems to be a mantra for them, yet they give their adult children no opportunity to put these lifestyles and choices into practice. They are scared to death of falling off the cliff at the first invitation to a public lunch with someone of the opposite sex. I don't care what anyone else says, they live in total fear of sin. They don't exercise their "religious muscles" at all. That, my friends,, IMO, can make you very weak.

Csnee317 said...

I won't get into the birthing debate here but my daughter was born via a planned C-section and I don't regret it at all. She is healthy and happy and that is all that matters.

I saw the first special a few weeks ago and they showed everything during the birth (I think that baby was Johannah). Michelle had a c-section and they showed her stomach and the doctors taking the baby out through the incision. Another hypocritical moment for the "modest" Duggar clan. Considering in other episodes they hold up a blanket so no one can see her belly during sonograms.

Anonymous said...

I think it is up to the woman to chose whether or not she wants medication, but it is not a failure to take an epidural or have a c-section. Sometimes it is necessary for the practitioner to intervene and guide the patient in the best direction. I think many young women feel they are a failure if they take an epidural. Would you have root canal without anesthesia- of course not. We practice water births in our hospital, and have several nurse midwives on staff.

Willow said...

I do not understand the reasons for unmedicated births. I mean, I don't understand why there isn't the opportunity for choice. The fundies (at least the Duggars anyway) seem to act like they think it is a sin to have any medication. Why is that a sin? I think their reasoning is based on finances. If I am missing something here, please enlighten me. I believe they assume they will have multiple children and they don't want women to get used to expensive hospitals and drugs, at least as long as there is not a life-threatening event. It appears they are willing to do whatever if it is absolutely necessary, but not until.

One other little point. I used to work for a GYN and every once in a blue moon, there was a husband who would insist on going in the exam room during his wife's pelvic exam, even with a female nurse present. These guys were not all religious extremists; most of them were just male-chauvinist, jealous control freaks (my opinion). There is no end to the different kinds of People out there. When you add the religious element, it is just too much. Women are giving birth to atone for the original sin, I don't think men need to keep "piling on".

Anonymous said...

I know this is probably a slim possibility and the Duggars and Bates might normally hang out on a frequent basis but it's becoming more evident because so many of them are on social media. However I think there might be a possible courtship/ getting to know you going on there. This past weekend Jill and Derrick went to a wedding in Tennessee and spent some time with the Bates. They then brought Lawson, Tori, and one of the other brothers back to Arkansas with them for a visit. They all went to Jill's wedding and stayed for at least a week afterwards. So what's the need for yet another visit so soon unless Tori or Lawson are interested in someone at the Duggar compound?

Sharla said...

Gentle reminder time. This blog is about the Duggars. If you want to discuss any Duggar births or birthing methods, that is great. We will not have a general debate on birthing methods though fun though it might be for some. Thank you!

Anonymous said...

Re:" Something else I'm curious about. Who pays for the chaperone to eat when they have a date? That's certainly a lot more money the guy has to have just to date a Duggar daughter or any women that follow this style of dating with a purpose."

I've wondered about this, too. They seem to order modestly. You can't even have a private conversation with someone you're supposed to be getting to know.

Bet said...

I was just watching the episode where Jubilee has died and her funeral. I think what I see time and time again with this family is their lack of education and how fearful they are. I wonder if we might talk about that a bit. I still can here echoes of Jim Bob's "Hola" while visiting Derek. And he wholeheartedly did not get that that was not appropriate.

Instead of using education to calm fear, they seem to run from knowledge, not realizing that they are being controlled by the very religion that they think sets them free.

I wait, with bated breath, for the Duggar that breaks out. The one that leaves and writes the tell all. That gets advanced college degrees. The one who, gasp, listens to public radio and asks questions.

I am often alarmed at the parallels between fundamentalist Mormon "keep sweet" and the fact that the Duggar family is always so chipper. Anger is a normal emotion and all that stuffing of emotions has bound to come out somewhere else. Its like a ticking time bomb. I wonder at the psychological damage these kids are receiving every single day. I wonder how many of them still are silently questing for answers or just counting the days until they can legally leave.

Ok, done rambling. Comments?

Anonymous said...

Will Jim Bob allow the cameras to get up and personal when his daughters are giving birth?

Anonymous said...

Have you seen the twitter pic of Josh, Anna and the kids playing with a soldier's rifle? Huh?
I did see the boys are wearing shorts.

Alberta Rose said...

One of my big issues with fundies is black and white thinking as we've seen here. Things are right or wrong, good or bad, biblical or not biblical without much thought or analysis. They can't comprehend shades of gray or nuance.

One of the fundies issues with this board is the black and white thinking. Women can't possibly want to be stay at home moms, can't possibly want to live at home until they get married, can't possibly want to save their body until their wedding night. It must be because they've been coerced into it. On the other hand, women who work outside the home, leave home before getting married or have premarital sex are simply being independent thinkers, not coerced into thinking this is the way to live. How about criticizing the plots, editing and lines of the show. The Duggars and their fellow fundamentalists have said 'this is how WE LIVE life". They have never said "This is how YOU MUST live life", yet whenever a fundamentalist comes to this board, they read "They MUST go to public school, They MUST use birth control, they MUST have post-secondary education, they MUST work at certain occupations". They read all sorts of messages about how they don't measure up, when their only sin is saying "This is how WE HAVE CHOSEN TO LIVE LIFE".

sandi said...

I suspect the home births save them money,and there is something biblical about 'giving birth in pain'...I don't recall the verse.Fundies always take these things too literally though.
And yes,sometimes pain intervention is necessary.I had an epidural b/c my blood pressure was going up due to the pain.
I was watching Anna's birth with Michael and was wondering if she was monitored closely enough in that respect..if at all? We didn't see any of that going on,although I know it was highly edited.She was obviously having a long, difficult birth,so it made me wonder.

Anonymous said...

My dear Alberta Rose, no one that I know here thinks it's wrong for women stay home if that's a free choice. There are SAHMs posting here. I am one. It is MY free choice though. I was brought up to get an education though so I could support myself if I never got married or my children if something happens to my spouse. Huge difference.

We do discuss the plotlines and story lines of the show. You know that and are conveniently ignoring that.

No one is saying what the Duggars must do, but saying it's a shame that they restrict their children so much. They believe in Gothard's perversion of scripture to this "umbrella of protection." That I object to mightily.

The Duggars say that they are open minded, but their actions betray their real beliefs. Josh has said Catholics aren't really Christians. He works for a truly dreadful organization and the Duggars participate in some really hateful statements about the Haulocaust and other things. They are careful to usually not be out and out derogatory, but they belong to a group that thinks their way to salvation is the only way and the rest of us Christians are doomed to Hell. Not at all a gracious attitude.

Jess said...

@ Bet, I agree 100% with what you've said

Beth Anne said...

Alberta Rose:

I respect the notion of "This is how we choose to live life." In fact, that type of choice is a beautiful thing. What I think many of us have pointed out is observations that there is a kind of peer pressure going on in Duggar land. I don't believe for a minute that Anna wasn't wishing for pain relief with Michael's birth. She was in total agony. What kept her from asking for it was a strict adherence to a pre-determined birth plan, a plan that I personally feel was not what SHE, as the birthing mother, independently formulated but, rather, what Anna felt obligated to follow, because "Good Fundamentalist Christian Wives Birth This Way."

You kind of hinted at that mentality yourself when you put everyone else in the category of "those who favour the shut up, dope up and obey Mainstream Society birthing method." That is black-or-white thinking...that there is the Duggar/Fundamentalist way to birth and the Mainstream way. There are all kinds of ways to live life. That is God's gift of free will. Hey, if Anna truly made choices of her own free will, I am happy. But I fear and believe otherwise.

Anonymous said...

It is quite obvious that the reason the Duggar kids don't go to a real school, even a Christian one, is to shelter and isolate them from any other child or teacher who might introduce independent thinking and the exploring of belief systems. They say "we love public school and it's a good thing),(Michelle), but they don't send any of their own kids even to a strict private Christian school. It's plain and simple. They are overprotective, scared to death, extremists and TLC tries to portray them in a more palatable manner to their viewers. They really need to get down to it and show them in their true lights so we can make our decisions if we want to continue watching something labeled as a "reality show".

Nancy Ann said...

Dear Alberta Rose: The Duggars, through their political actions, are trying to determine what other people can and should do. That is my issue with them. If they were just an extremely conservative Christian family living in Arkansas I wouldn't even know about them. They have placed themselves on TV as a "ministry", meaning that they are setting themselves as an example to others as to the way they should think and live. They have drawn people in to IBLP/ATI, which I believe is a cult. They are very politically active and are trying hard to legislate their own morality. Their son works for a hate group that is trying to legislate their version of morality. Yes, the Duggars are trying to make others follow their rules. That is why I have a problem with them. By the way, I was raised to be a Fundamentalist, so I have a good understanding of what drives the Duggars. The rest of my family still are Fundamentalists, so I am exposed to that thought process regularly.

Anonymous said...

Jim Bob will never allow them to show his daughters actually giving birth the way they did with Anna. There's a lot that's ok for a daughter-in-law that won't be ok for a daughter. All you need to do is think about JB & Michelle, & how they are carrying on about the "loss of Jill." There was no loss for the Keller family when Anna married Josh. The Duggars just kept saying they had added a daughter. Nobody in the Duggar family thought anything bout Anna leaving her family, & moving so far away. They started with the same "loss line," when Josh & Anna moved to DC,because it involved one of their own biological children..Josh. The first Duggar child to move out of Arkansas.

Anonymous said...

RE: Michelle's contradictions. In a repeat today, it was the first episode after the loss of Jubilee. Michelle said, that as a "momma," she probably was grieving more than anyone else in the family. She then made the statement, that just that morning, Jennifer, had said she wanted to see,Jubilee & play with her. I cannot believe a child Jenny's age 4-5 who never laid eyes on this baby to come, was saying she really wanted to play with her. It's not like all of a sudden Jordyn wasn't there & she was missing her,& asking to play with her.I truly believe Michelle has serious mental issues.

Alberta Rose said...

The peer pressure goes both ways. It's not just fundamentalists who are peer pressured. "I voted Democrat, your grandpa voted Democrat, your great-great, we've always voted democrat". "Oh, you're not into Oprah, Dr. Phil, Dr. Oz?" and despite the fact all the kids are the same age, in the same classroom, guess who doesn't get invited to the next Mommy get together?" "You have a copy of "It Takes A Child To Raise A Village"? Isn't that a strange book for someone who votes to the right?" and suddenly the couple is too busy to chat the next three times they cross paths." Peer pressure is not just the domain of the Fundamentalists. Plus if Michelle and Jim Bob were truly into peer pressuring their children, why on earth would they be so accepting of none of their sons showing an interest in real estate? Why would they allow their daughters into a profession that would cause a clip of the daughters helping a tattooed man and his wife bring their baby into the world? The Landscaping Repair business that John David does causes him to cross paths with all sorts of different types of people yet he is not discouraged. Plus he is also not being peer pressured into entering into courtship, despite the fact there are secular men his age who are told "You've got your business established, your older brother is married, one of your sisters is married, the other one is in courtship, you HAVE to get married or the tabloids will claim your the homosexual Duggar".

Just me said...

I've been wondering when exactly and how the Duggars started to dress "modern modest". It clearly happened around the time of 17 & counting but I wonder if it was at the prodding of a producer or if JB thought it up all by himself. It was clearly to make them more marketable and the kids joyfully latched on but I want to know that initial conversation. I can see them having a family meeting or evening bible study and JB declaring that he and Mama talked about this and prayed on it and decided it was good for the family to...

Anonymous said...

I need to correct myself. I wrote & said that Michelle said Jennifer came to her & said she wanted to play with Jubilee. I was wrong, she said it was; Jordyn. She said Jordyn said; "Oh Jubilee died & she's with Jesus, I want to go and play with her." Jordyn was only 3 yrs. old at that time. I can't believe a 3 yr old would actually say that. Besides, Jordyn doesn't even talk that much.

Anonymous said...

Just wanted to pass this on for discussion. http://www.fishwrapper.com/post/2014/08/05/josh-duggar-pictures-photos-assault-rifle-gun-children-baby-scary-dangerous-awful/

Reality TV Junkie said...

I remember during one of Anna's pregnancies, she said that she wants a natural birth because of the quicker recovery, not because Michelle told her to.

Willow said...

Yes Nancy Ann, and what also scares me is that the Duggars seem to be quite influential to young people. Their children are so cute and likeable and fans could easily be star-struck and think their way of life must be great. In other words, some very subtle brainwashing of kids into the "cult" and thus, more $ and people for their cause, er, I mean ministry. I'm not saying this very well, but I hope you all know what I am trying to get at.

Andrea said...

I just wanted to point out that it appears Jill attended a wedding this weekend for friends of Derick's - Madison and Madelyn. I looked up their wedding website and they actually appear normal. Both are college graduates. High hopes for Jill! I think that with Derick's influence she may actually turn into a normal person!

Anonymous said...

Parental/Cult leader mindcontrol is not peer pressure.You can't experience peer pressure unless you are exposed to your peers. The Duggar children are not allowed to have peers, much less watch television, go online or have a phone conversation privately. They can't leave the house alone. No chance of any peers influencing them

Ginger said...

My head is spinning from the comment about the Duggars being so worldly& accepting, that they allowed their daughter to help a tattooed man & his wife bring a baby into the world. Nobody in my family has any tattooos,(although I have no problem with tattoos) but I wouldn't have any problem with a daughter of mine that was a midwife or nurse, helping a tattooed man & his wife bring their baby into the world. That shows a very biased view, as that man may be a wonderful upstanding, Godly, Christian man. Did you look at his tattoos? Perhaps they were of a cross of a picture of Christ. Would the Duggars allow their daughter to help an unmarried girl & her boyfriend bring a baby into the world? That's the real question!

confused in Germany said...

To Alberta Rose, I agree with you in so far, as they say, it is their life and how THEY live it, abut they also say: we see this as a ministry to show how others could live their life. That is o.k. with me. They give their viewers a different life choice. What annoys me is, that they don't really give their kids the same choice to really get to know a different life style. That need not mean, that they do a rumspringa, like some of the Amish kids get to do, but a little closer knowledge of life out of the compound would make their decision more rounded. Then they would KNOW and UNDERSTAND, why they don't choose that life and have a peaceful life - more or less :-) - as a stay at home Mom, not working outside the home, but inside the home. That is not a bad choice, my Mom made it and never regretted it. But she did work before she started having children. So she had the choice and that was in the 1950-ies. I think and you may correct me, if I have read it wrong (!), that what most writers bemoan is, that those kids don't get to choose. And yes, because, we are living in this other world, we may tend more to an independent life, with a job outside the home. Still, even in this, we have the choice. As I said, I know life with my Mom staying at home, but I chose to live differently, not because I think my Moms choice wrong, but because it wasn't my dream. Those girls and boys don't even get to dream, let alone chose. That is sad. Even though it is only my oppinion.

Anonymous said...

I was watching the rerun of David and Priscilla's wedding yesterday. My husband walked in the room, not knowing what I was watching, or who those two were. In the scene after their wedding ceremony, my husband said: "what are they, 12 years old?" It's so painfully obvious that the large majority of these "marrying children" of this belief system are so child like and their maturity has been stunted to that of a jr high school kid.

Anonymous said...

IMO, the reason the Duggar sons aren't "pressured" to go into real estate is because Jim Bob has cornered that market for this family. The boys to into other fields that would benefit the family... it's called diversity. The reason the other kids aren't pressured into marrying and leaving is because it would NOT benefit Jim Bob and Michelle. Remember, everyone in that household, serves them, even Mary Duggar. I don't see Michelle, honoring her mom in law by doing Mary Duggar's laundry.. COme on, Michelle, you are decades younger than your mother in law and should be doing for her in keeping with your so called beliefs...

Anonymous said...

Re the comment about Jill and Jana helping in the delivery of the shirtless, tattooed father... look at that footage again. Did you seen either of those girls near that room at the time he removed his shirt? NO.. they were in the other room, out of sight where they could not be defrauded. I guarantee you, that they had nothing to do with that couple at that time. The other assistants handled it. It was neatly edited and pasted together to minimize that fact.

Londonbridges said...

I agree totally that there is no danger of the Duggar blessings being influenced by peer-pressure. When and where could this happen? Well said, Anonymous 9:11p.m.

Anonymous said...

re: Beth Ann's comments especially about when Anna was in labor with Michael. She actually was asking for help. She kept crying & saying, "I just can't do this, please help me." Unfortunately for her, there was no certified medical help there. All Anna had available to her was, sister-in-laws, a doula (Miss Theresa), a mother in-law & last but not least, a husband who felt that such along & grueling labor called for nap on his part. If that had been my son, I would have grabbed him & asked him what the he.., he was doing going in for a nap while his wife was in such agony. Not one person there for Anna's delivery realized the potential for disaster with that delivery. Anna was in agony, but absolutely felt she had to adhere to the pre-determined plan. The fact that Michelle kept saying she would deliver within the next 15 min. was insane. It was another 18 hrs. of labor. I remember that they were not using DR Sarver for Michaels' birth. They had gone to an independent facility to find out the gender of the baby. They then proceeded to have a home birth where everyone was running from room to room putting down sheets of plastic etc. They didn't know what they were doing, & Anna & Michael were both fortunate to come out of that experience alive.

Anonymous said...

re; Csnee317 comments. They also showed Michelle's stomach when she was delivering Josie.

Marites H. said...

I need to correct myself. I wrote & said that Michelle said Jennifer came to her & said she wanted to play with Jubilee. I was wrong, she said it was; Jordyn. She said Jordyn said; "Oh Jubilee died & she's with Jesus, I want to go and play with her." Jordyn was only 3 yrs. old at that time. I can't believe a 3 yr old would actually say that. Besides, Jordyn doesn't even talk that much.
*********************************
As a preschool teacher for 16 years I'd have to agree with this comment that it's highly unlikely for a 3 year old to put together full sentences and concepts like this. My heart goes out to these little ones who are watching "mama" get married and move away, leaving them to deal with Michelle.

Nancy Ann said...

For anyone who thinks the Duggars are accecpting of people who think, act, dress and believe differently than they do, please read this article. It is about the ATI curriculum assignment that has children making broad judgments about others based on their perceived looks, clothing and demeanor. The Duggars are constantly judging others, just as they were taught by ATI to do. They keep it under wraps for the cameras, but please don't fool yourself into believing that they are accepting of all people.

http://www.recoveringgrace.org/2014/07/judging-101-2/

Reality TV Junkie said...

RE: Jordyn telling Michelle about wanting to play with Jubilee.

I don't think this is a hard thing to believe. It's likely that during the pregnancy Michelle was talking about all the things once they have a new baby sister, playing together being one of them. Kids have an awfully good memory too, so this comment by Jordyn, albeit not word for word, seems plausible.

Beth Anne said...

Regarding the "tolerance" of JimBob and Michelle and their children's chosen professions...

Don't mean to nit pick, but you have to take a closer look at what professions the older kids have tinkered with. Lo and behold, they all fall into the realm of careers deemed acceptable by Gothard/ATI and, thus, deemed acceptable to the parents. ATI teachings indicate that young men should work in self-employed professions (tow truck driver, landscaper) so that they do not have another boss, but politics is OK because of the potential advancement of an agenda. Midwifery is an advocated career path (only when unmarried), so OF COURSE JimBob and Michelle would endorse that for their daughters. Babysitting/child care is AOK as well.

What I mean by peer pressure is that JimBob and Michelle are well aware of what is deemed acceptable or not for their children to do in the eyes of their fundamentalist peers and act accordingly. I would be much more impressed with their "tolerance" if they totally OK'd Jinger's request to go live in a city and go to a photography school to fine-tune her craft, if they OK'd Josiah's choice to head to community college to study accounting, or were cool with Joy Anna working part-time at a coffee shop because she wanted to earn extra spending money.

Anonymous said...

During that wonderful "water birth", it was obvious that Anna had no idea what was going on. Nothing was explained to her. . .she was railroaded into it and scared to death unneccessarily. As the baby starts coming, she cries/whimpers "shouldn't we empty the water now?" and something like "please don't let my baby drown". Just plain cruelty and disregard for her IMO

Elspeth said...

The day a Duggar enters an actual profession and not a job or a trade, let me know. They'll have to finish a four year degree at a bare minimum to have a profession and that isn't happening any time soon. :)

Bet said...

To me, as a parent, allowing my child out in the world in public school has proven to be adequate testing ground for our moral values. It's also offered life experiences to talk about and learn from. I would like to ask JimBob and Michelle how they can claim to be strong in their faith, yet not trusting that their children and their Lord could stand up to the challenges of the world.

I feel the same way about any overprotective parent. Those that won't let their kids fail or manage themselves, expecting that when they're 18, they'll miraculously be able to handle themselves without practice.

Now, I know the Duggar parents expect their daughters to be sold into marriage before they begin to have questions. And then so busy breeding and raising children that they won't have time. And they expect their boys to follow in Daddy's footstep-- and the power structure there must be appealing. But, what about just life decisions. Will they always be going to JimBob and Michelle for counsel? What happens when the Duggar parents die?

Also, if skirts are modest and long hair is Biblical, why don't the boys have long hair and wear robes?

Oh, so many questions. Obviously, I would be the bad seed in that family! Given the opportunity, I would love to really talk to this family. Oh, but where to start.

Anonymous said...

I'd like to know why the Duggars don't do a season-end reunion type show with a moderator/interviewer there asking the questions that we want to hear like some of the other 'reality shows' do. I know they've answered general questions on the show in the past, but let's face it, those are pre-approved 'how many boxes of cereal does the family go through' and 'how many loads of laundry does Grandma do' in a day kind of stuff. I'd like to see them in a live studio setting where the questions, answers, and reactions can't be pre-approved and sugar coated. Of course I doubt that will ever happen as Jim Boob wouldn't be in complete control like he is at Duggar World.

tulip said...

Yes, it's so ridiculous that Josh is executive director of anything in his 20s w/ no degree to show. No, a GED does not count. I assume John David still runs a towing 'business', what is Jana doing at almost 25, besides trying to act like she's interested in doula training & cooking for the little kids? Jinger, Joseph, Josiah, what in the world are they doing? A whole lot of nothing except keeping up w/ Duggar Instagram. IMO Ben is extremely annoying, just a cocky kid, kind of reminds me of Josh in a way.
If Josh & Anna are still leaving their baby making up to God, she would be pregnant again already. Either their libido has taken a huge dive or they're doing what they can to strategically plan conception so as not to coincide with any other Duggar events.
I think Michelle most likely being done w/ conceiving is affecting her, as she looks so thin, & not like a healthy thin, but like pounds are dropping off from too much workout on the elliptical, maybe focusing all her energy on that to keep her mind off not being able to have any more babies. Why is JB continually recycling his FOB suit? Not to mention, it doesn't look like it fits properly, hanging too loose and kind of slouchy.
All I see Cousin Amy doing is hanging out w/ her newest BF, taking trips (related to her music 'career' Lol) and goofing off, while most other nearly 30-yr. olds are acting their age & working hard.
Ok, so there's the Duggar name for you.

Nancy Ann said...

Anonymous asked us yesterday about the photo of Josh's family with Michael and Marcus touching a gun (Josh is holding it). The photo is on his Twitter page. I think it is terrible to have a baby and a preschooler posing with a gun for a photo. But more than that, I think we are starting to see the true colors of the Duggar family through the social media faux pas of the adult Duggar offspring. These are people who were severely limited as to their social interactions the whole time they were growing up. They were also kept away from most everything on the internet. They don't know how to handle social media because they have such limited social skills and so little practice with social media. They get married and POOF! they are adults. Except they don't know how to behave as adults because they have had no practice. They have been taught that self-control means obeying immediately and cheerfully, not the real dictionary meaning of self-control. Mostly, I think the photo with Josh's family and the gun is juvenile and speaks volumes about the maturity level of Josh and Anna.

Anonymous said...

Re: Sandi's comment about having an epidural because her blood pressure was so high. That made me think that when Anna was in labor with both Mac & Michael, there was nobody taking her blood pressure. We know that Jill wasn't doing it even though she was there, because at a much later date, we saw her midwife mentor teaching her how to take a blood pressure. Ms Theresa a doula was there when Mac was born, but she wasn't there when Michael was born.

Anonymous said...

I respect everyone's opinion, so if Reality, TV Junkie believes its' plausible that Jordyn could put together that sentences, & know what she was saying. I respect her opinion. I don't agree but that's JMHO. Especially since Michelle herself has said, that Jordyn doesn't speak very clearly, or in sentences.

Kerstin said...

As for Josh's job: I believe that all thetraveling and being on the show were job descriptions. His only qualification since he has no degree is his fame and his presence on TV and in social media. If he only has an office job, he probably csn't promote the organisation and its agenda.

Anonymous said...

Although often times Anna drives me crazy, I never felt as much sympathy for anyone, going through the birthing process as I did for her. With Mac, her first pregnancy & birth everything is going along fine, when she starts in labor they realize DR Sarver is away. Josh decides they should have a home birth. The Dugars are away at Big Sandy & even JB seems shocked at the home birth idea. His only solutions is, "pray about it, & I'll put momma & Jill on a plane." Anna going through her first labor & delivery not knowing what she's going to face, but she's going through it with just Josh & Miss Theresa, a doula. Then comes Michael, a whole different story. That's the real issue, you never know what will happen. It can go smoothly or it can be a horror show. Anna suffered something awful with Michael's birth & what angers me the most is, to this day, I don't think anyone but Anna, realizes just how much agony she was in. I do need to mention Marcus' birth because, although they had a midwife & apparently had discussed a "water birth," I truly believe that Anna thought the water was for labor only & when it was very close to delivery she was petrified that her baby was going to drown. Someone didn't do their job of explaining a water birth to her, or it was simply a case of her being in such pain, that she became so frightened, that she couldn't remember or think straight...who can think straight under those conditions? I give Anna credit, but I think it's time she stood up for herself. She let Josh be in charge of her labor & delivery 3 times, another time I wouldn't chance it. I truly wonder if he even realized, with Michael, she could have hemorrhaged or suffered such severe internal trauma that she could never carry another baby. We know about Michelle's deliveries, I wonder about Anna's mom. Did she have all home births?

Anonymous said...

RE: Alberta Roses comment about the fact that the landscaping/repair business that John David has causes him to cross paths with all sorts of people & still he's not discouraged. Alberta Rose, the man wants desperately to be a pilot. He's earning money anyway he can so he can take those very expensive flying lessons. If he doesn't get his license after all his hard work I think he will be eventually become very depressed. We know he worked very hard & purchased a home of his own, that he cannot live in until he marries. That's right out of Jim Bob's mouth.

Anonymous said...

Re comments on John David and his work...
It's a shame that that person is a man and is being forced to live like a child. He has a wonderful interest in flying and will not be able to pursue it and to let it serve him well for his future work. Being a pilot requires "brains" and this guy seems to have them for flying. Those two parents should hang their heads in shame for stifeling their sons as well as their daughters. Didn't Jim Bob have the freedom and capability to pursue what he wanted to accomplish? YES..his mother didn't lock him at home and dictate what he was allowed to do. I think those two need to be called on the carpet and on LIVE TV with no "prepping" of questions and answers and see how well they fare.
Also, on another site, there is a photo of Jim Bob and Michelle holding a Knights of Columbis poster with it's symbol. The Knights are a Roman Catholic mens' organization. They look like two hypocrites with those banners, IMO, as they don not stand for what the Knights believe and dedicate themselves to. I know because my husband is a Knight.

Anonymous said...

I'm re watching the episode where Josh proposes to Anna. It seemed way more realistic than Derick proposing to Jill. Anna had a look of genuine surprise and shock on her face. I remember someone making the comment that Anna deserves way more than a half of a carat. I imagine that he probably did not have a lot of money at the time. Especially since Jim Bob said the car business was a mess until Anna started helping him out. I wonder if Ben is also waiting to propose until he has enough seed money and money for an engagement ring. And I wonder if his move and new job has something to do with that.

Anonymous said...

I think it says a lot more about the snobbishness of anyone who criticizes someone else's engagement ring. I don't think Jill got a two carat ring either.

Bet said...

The sad thing is, these people are breeding like rabbits. And they are willingly, knowingly, staying uneducated. In just a few generations, they will be a strong voting body. This scares me to death.

By uneducated, I don't just mean non-degreed. Anybody can get a degree. I mean non-questing, non-questioning people who will vote the way someone with authority over them desires. This is an easily led population.

Has anyone done any research that will calm my nerves? I mean, I've read that in 6 generations the Duggar family alone will number in the millions. That's a lot of little voters.

Marites H. said...

Every woman's preference on engagement rings is different. Anna seemed completely clueless about the proposal but Jill had a pretty good idea of what was up with Derrick.

Other women were shocked when they found out I talked my fiancé into buying a smaller diamond than the "rock" he wanted. I have very petite hands (ring size 4 1/4) so I didn't think a "rock" would look good on my ring finger. I let him pick out the wedding band with a row of diamonds.

All I can remember from Josh & Anna's engagement is that totally awkward side hug. These "kids" and I do mean that they are "kids" have no experience with the opposite sex and yet are catapulted into baby-making time the moment the bridal suite's door shuts. I'm sure Jill & her sisters are nice girls but they are more like jr-highers than twentysomethings. I also feel bad for JD who is at home sharing a bedroom with the howler monkeys while he has his own home that he can't live in just because he doesn't have a wife yet.

Emilya842 said...

Bet,

I agree. An large, uneducated, voting body is very scary. However, I don't think the Duggar clan will number into the millions within 6 generations. I don't think the reproductive numbers can be sustained at the rate needed reach that number. Some (hopefully many) of the children will leave the quiverfull lifestyle and some will have conception difficulties. Within the ATI/Gothard lifestyle, adoption is a big no-no, so biological children are a couple's only option.

Also,some have asked why the Duggars seem so opposed to pain medication during childbirth. I think the reason women in ATI/Gothardism/Quiverful/Et Al choose (read: are pressured) into labor/delivery without pain medication is their belief in biblical literalism. In Genesis, as punishment for the fall, God tells Eve that he will increase her pains during childbirth. I think the people within this movement see any form of pain relief during childbirth as a sin because labor/delivery pain is a punishment from God.

Anonymous said...

I wish John David was strong enough to just walk out the door and take his twin with him!

Anonymous said...

I would like to say that I have serious concerns about Jana and Jinger's weight. They both seem to have lost a significant amount of weight over the summer and are looking incredibly thin. They were not over weight before, but these 2 especially are looking under weight to me. I hope they are Ok.
Am I the only one that is hoping that all of Jana's trips to DC are to spend time with a potential suitor? She and Joseph went fo r the ski trip, and now she spent basically all of July in DC. I am really hoping she is courting someone in DC.....she deserves to get away....even if it is to one of Josh's ultra conservative friends or co workers.
Anything is better than staying at the TTH raising Jackson and Josie.

Anonymous said...

Re Jana comments:

Yes, I agree with you, anonymous, that they have dropped weight. Also Jill has dropped a significant amount of lbs for her wedding and she didn't need to lose any weight at all. Remember, it goes along with their fundamental beliefs that females must remain slender and attractive.
Sadly, I don't think that Jana is courting anyone, Michelle would not let her; she is far too valuable to let her go, so selfish of Michelle, I think she was "lended out" as an au pair for Anna, who seems to be overwhelmed already with just 3 kids and that "house of steps" they live in. Jana is just being used again, I fear.

Zoey said...

Who cares how big Jill's ring is. I'm sure Derrick used his walmart discount for it :)

Anonymous said...

Jill's ring was purchased in Israel.

Anonymous said...

Right on about Jana being 'slaved out' to Anna and Josh in DC. She and John David should just get in that tow truck of his and drive away.

Anonymous said...

Does Jim Boob really think we believe his buy used and save the difference phony talk. One of today's reruns showed Duggars shooting off more than 200 pieces of fireworks, definitely didn't buy them used and saved the difference. The same is true for the bottles full of makeup used by the older girls. Hey Jim Boob, if you really want to demonstrate buying used and saving the difference, I've got a bunch of used lottery tickets I'll sell you for half-price. In all seriousness though, things just don't add up. Families who truly are trying to live financially modestly would not spend the dollars they do on large amounts of fireworks, processed foods, disposable dishes, and the list goes on and on.

Anonymous said...

Wouldn't it be great if John David, Jana and the other Duggar young adults could all get jobs and go live together in John David's house. No little buddies to take care of or meals to prepare for a 25 member family. They could sit around on a weekend night and have pizza and beer and watch non Daddy approved movies. They sorely need some freedom and independence.

Anonymous said...

I hope Jinger and Jana aren't losing a significant amount of weight because they are working like slaves from sun up to sun down!

I wonder if JB & M ever notice when anything is wrong with any of their children?

Anonymous said...

I don't believe JB & Michelle ever notice or concern themselves with the health of their children, or any other problems they might have such as being; hyperactive & ADHD. I'm sick of always hearing how the little kids (howlers) have so much energy. Some are definitely hyperactive & some definitely have some degree of learning disabilities. These are just as important as an obvious physical aliments, like severe weight loss,colds, flu, chicken pox. It took 3 or 4 kids, before they realized that. When the kids had the chicken pox, some of them had them in their eyes, which would have been of great concern to me as a mom, but it didn't seem like a big deal to them. Jill appears to have reading glasses, but I've never heard anything about the little kids. Based on what I see around me, I think a lot of young kids need glasses, but of course that's picked up in school where the teacher realizes there is a problem. We hear about the kids going to the dentist, but that's all, never regular physicals, again required for school& we don't know about any immunizations except with Josie. JB & Michelle only have eyes for each aother.

Anonymous said...

I highly doubt that Jim Bob and Michelle really notice each of their children at all. It is obvious to many of us that some of the little ones have hyperactivity/ADD situations going on there. They don't have a clue about their kids, really.
There simply are too many of them for any real quality one on one time. I don't believe their bull-loney.
Michelle is quite cruel to Jana, putting what should be HER work on a young daughter. They have a lot of sleep there company, and dinner guests because it is Jana who has to cook for them, not Michelle. She is the most lazy woman I have observed in a very long time. I still don't know what she actually does all day as far as what HER own chores are..No one says because there aren't any. I hope Jana gets the heck out of there soon and Michelle will be quite stunned at the amount of work that Jana did. I don't think she bothers to really consider it at all.

Willow said...

The dentist is way more important than the immunizations, etc., because there is so much emphasis on "countenance". They probably have never even heard of ADHD, hyperactivity, etc. Do they even listen to the news, ever?

Anonymous said...

Yesterday in a repeat, when the Duggars ended up with all the kittens, & Michelle was teaching the kids how to feed them, burp them, & teach them to use the restroom-- yes that's exactly what she said, not use the litter box or potty train them, but use the restroom. I remembered that when that episode was on originally, a number of bloggers asked who ever heard of teaching kittens to burp? Yesterday in a detailed explanation JB, explained, that when Michelle was in High School, she volunteered at a shelter & she learned how to handle the kittens when she was a volunteer. If anyone wonders if someone reads this blog..there's your answer.

Anonymous said...

I think Jana is an extremely depressed young woman. I have many suspicions, I know they are only my own about these; "Journey to the Heart excursions she;s gone on. I remember how pleased & proud, JB & Michelle were as they sent her off to the Gothard facility. She's eventually going to need to take over Grandma's duties as grandma can't be expected to be a laundress for many more yrs. Perhaps she now realizes how long the road ahead is for her, as her mom's maid. I think she is the sweetes & most beautiful young woman & my heart goes out to her. Nobody cares. It's a lot like Jordyn's situation has been ever since she was a baby

Anonymous said...

According to Jessa's Instagram, she and Joy are doing some sort of "food challenge" at eating the same meal for breakfast, lunch, and I believe dinner for 3 weeks. I seriously hope this is not some sort of diet. While healthy eating is always a good thing and we obviously see them eating a lot of processed food, I just hope they aren't feeling any pressure from anyone. For breakfast they have 2 eggs and green beans and for lunch they have baked sweet potato fries and baked chicken. She hasn't posted their dinner yet.

Anonymous said...

8/9 12:38 anonymous: I, unfortunately, agree with you completely. Jana really needs God's saving by getting that poor young woman OUT of there and into a wonderful life of her own, whatever one it is that truly makes her happy. She does look underlyingly sad and trying to "smile" a lot.Once again, shame on her parents.

Anonymous said...

One more thing, Jana's mouth may curve up and smile, but her eyes don't. The eyes don't lie. Such a sham that her parents don't even notice..and they have the nerve to lie and say what quality time they spend with "each and every one of them". Bull-loney.

Anonymous said...

I feel bad for Jana too. I pray she never had any contact with Gothard while away at
Journey to the Heart. After all the allegations, I would never my daughter near him. Sadly, the Duggars don't appear to even care enough to ask Jana if Gothard mistreated her in any way.

Anonymous said...

They're following a current eating fad of no sugar, no milk products, no grains, etc for 30 days. It should all be no processed food at all. It's a take off on a paleo diet.

Judy said...

Jana makes me very sad

Anonymous said...

When you "train up" your kids to believe that your interpretation of everything is "gospel" and tell them that their parents are their rulers of everything and to know about or listen to yourself or anyone else is a sin that will put you in hell, how can Jana ever say "I don't want to do that, mama. I'd rather do this instead."
IMO, that is a sin that JimBob and Michelle are committing against their own children as they are removing ANY and ALL personal liberty or pursuit of happiness within their own lives. It is a very straight and narrow path that these adult kids MUST walk. Sadly, poor sweet Jana will never deviate from what her parents tell her is "ok" for fear of sinning. I believe that makes her parents cruel people, not these sweet religious icons of everything that some fans make of them. They themselves are quite an ignorant pair.

pretty girl said...

what is up with all this socail media i thought the duggars do not do social media at all

Anonymous said...

I feel very bad for Jana. I saw the episode where she cried in front of an ATI conference because she was recounting a story where she had given up her favorite jewelry box to jessa because they weren't getting along. It's so sad, bc I think symbolically she has been doing that all her life for all her "little buddies." And of course jessa was there just smirking, not really giving any insight or emotion to add to Jana's story.

Anonymous said...

RE; Jana giving up her prized jewelry box to Jessa, who was just there smirking. What about JB & Michelle & their responsibility in that. Jana talked with her parents about how annoyed she was with Jessa,& they advised her to find a way that would work things out to everyone's satisfaction. They were basically advising Jana, as they always do to;keep sweet. She had to do whatever was needed to get along with her sister, who was clearly in the wrong. So it goes way back with Jana needing to please everyone. JB & Michelle thought that was the right thing for Jana to do, give up her own little treasure for a sister who was being a brat.Her mom should have taken Jessa aside & told her: enough, leave your sister alone, or you will suffer the consequence. Yet JB & Michelle are always talking about how well their kids get along, they share, they play well together etc. They don't even have a clue what's going on in their own home.Jana is a obviously a very sensitive young woman, & to this day that episode reduced her to tears. Yet JB & Michelle thought it was great.

Anonymous said...

RE; Jana giving up her prized jewelry box to Jessa, who was just there smirking. What about JB & Michelle & their responsibility in that. Jana talked with her parents about how annoyed she was with Jessa,& they advised her to find a way that would work things out to everyone's satisfaction. They were basically advising Jana, as they always do to;keep sweet. She had to do whatever was needed to get along with her sister, who was clearly in the wrong. So it goes way back with Jana needing to please everyone. JB & Michelle thought that was the right thing for Jana to do, give up her own little treasure for a sister who was being a brat.Her mom should have taken Jessa aside & told her: enough, leave your sister alone, or you will suffer the consequence. Yet JB & Michelle are always talking about how well their kids get along, they share, they play well together etc. They don't even have a clue what's going on in their own home.Jana is a obviously a very sensitive young woman, & to this day that episode reduced her to tears. Yet JB & Michelle thought it was great. Jana gave up her treasure & Jessa remained a brat who never even said she was sorry & she had the opportunity to do that right there in front of everyone when Jana was telling the story. Jana was hurt & it's ever too late for an apology

Anonymous said...

I agree about Jana and her jewelry box. It was a shame that she suffered because of her sister.
All Michelle seems to be able to do when any situation arises is laugh. I am tired of enduring her "fake laugh" and how hoarse it is. What's wrong with her voice? (besides being that of a 5 year old)Anyone else notice this?

Anonymous said...

I have been reading a little on the Seewald family's new blog. There is a post entitled "Marrying Young". It seems they are advocates for marrying young, which totally explains trying to marry Ben off to Jessa. However, I found this statement to be very interesting:

"There is also the idea that if a young man or woman has romantic feelings for someone that they are giving a little piece of their heart to them. If it turns out they don’t marry that particular person then there will be less of their heart for their spouse. While there is evidence that this is true in a sexual relationship it is absurd to think it is true of mere romantic feelings. There is no basis for this in Scripture. Parents can guilt their children to death over these feelings which are unavoidable."

I don't know if I am reading too much into this or not, but is this sort of a slam against the Duggars and all of the "guard your heart" nonsense they spout?

Nancy Ann said...

It's one thing to raise your children in a very strict Christian household. It is another thing altogether not to allow your adult children to be a pilot, a nurse or a photographer because those grown offspring will encounter people who were not raised as conservatively. What good is faith if a person can never interact with others who believe differently, for fear of being lead astray? How strong a faith is that? The Duggars and their ilk think that Christians in America are being persecuted, but they don't get within an arm's length of anyone who would test their faith. Ridiculous.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 1:37 8/10:
Yes, it sure is a slam against the Duggar "guard your heart crap". I thought the very same thing. I don't believe that anyone should "push" anyone into marriage when they just aren't ready yet for it. Ben is still ony 19yrs old. That is pretty young. Jessa is 22, not a good mix, IMO.
Having said that, I also believe that even if you aren't a virgin at your marriage ceremony, it certainly doesn't mean that you have less to give your intended spouse upon marriage, in fact, it may mean that you have MORE to give after experiencing life. You may have sinned, in some eyes, but that doesn't mean that you are less of a spouse to the person that you have committed your life to and the same goes for your spouse committing to you. You are more learned and realize maybe a little more what that step of marriage and committed love actually mean. You also may hold a life long lasting appreciation and excitement for the relationship you have with your spouse. That makes it sweeter. These people think that keeping themselves encased in ice until you marry is the best way to go. I believe that a heart that has been "tried" and maybe broken is a more sympathetic loving one after suffering a lost love.

Anonymous said...

In one show, Anna tells Michael how they're going to practice "instant obedience" at the store. The Duggar kids were raised on "instant obedience" and it will take a strong sibling to go against Mama and Daddy's will even as adults. One way might be if an older kid shares some regret with a younger one then decides to run with it.

I think the multitude of guests, 1000+, invited to the wedding was to show off that they have so many "friends." Since the guests were fed cupcakes and chocolate chip cookies, it certainly wasn't to be generous hosts and "do for others" as they could have well afforded at this point in time.

Jill says she married her best friend which is wonderful except that the Duggar kids have likely never made a close friend on their own who didn't go through some kind of contact with Pa and Ma or Gothard first. Derick is undoubtedly Jill's first close friend and it's great that she and Derick are best friends, but how sad that he is her only best friend. She never knew the joy of having a best girl friend with whom she could share private thoughts and get support.

Anonymous said...

I just saw the pics from the Duggar photo op, I mean mission, to Central America. Big cheesy grins on the Duggars. I guess I'm just a confused heathen, but if you only have 2 weeks, why spend it giving mani-pedis to children who look like they'd rather be somewhere else. Except for the Duggars and their team, everyone looked like they'd rather be somewhere else.

Allison said...


"I don't know if I am reading too much into this or not, but is this sort of a slam against the Duggars and all of the "guard your heart" nonsense they spout?"

Actually I take this as being a response to people who wonder why it's okay for Jessa to say "I love you" so often and yet not touch Ben at all. It seems to be a very passive aggressive answer to something that has been mentioned a number of time.

"It's one thing to raise your children in a very strict Christian household. It is another thing altogether not to allow your adult children to be a pilot, a nurse or a photographer because those grown offspring will encounter people who were not raised as conservatively."

IMO, I don't think the Duggars necessarily stop their children from pursuing these things because they might encounter non-Christians. I think there is a really strong sense of commitment to family. For example, 1) I don't think Jill pursued a nursing degree because she has to frequently attend all the Duggar events and that's the priority. Same with John David. I don't think his little projects are much more than hobbies and/or he may have someone working for him who can cover when he's out of town. I think that's how Josh managed all his travel while owning the car dealership. He had a couple guys working for him who could keep afloat while he was out of town. The expectation is to have loyalty to the Duggar family, and to be separated or not have all 19 (or at least as many as possible) during these events is unfathomable. They are like the Borg, a cohesive unit and not allowed to be separate. They are the Duggar Family of 19 Kids and Counting. Not individuals who are a lot to do what they need to do. The Bates Family on the other hand does not have this persona, and so you can see from Kelly's writings that the kids do things independently quite a bit, such as Lawson's music career. Just my observations of course.

pretty girl said...

seems to me the duggars are now becoming wordly. they all have social media accounts and look so much different from when you first saw them on tv.

capslock said...

Did anyone happen to see Dateline on Friday night about Rebecca Musser who played an integral part in bringing down Warren Jeffs (escaping from the FLDS compound)?

She looked JUST LIKE Michelle (google her) and I was amazed how much the FLDS religion is just like the Duggars. It really freaked me out when I saw their slogan is Sweetness Always - never question, always smile, marry young, do whatever your husband tells you to do.

It really gave me the creeps because the more I watched, the more I saw a lot of Warren Jeffs in Jim Bob!

Anonymous said...

I have two thoughts on the subject of guarding your heart. First of all, even with a courtship, one person could be falling in love and if the other person calls off the courtship, wouldn't the one left behind have already given away a piece of their heart, whether or not there was a physical relationship? Secondly, with this distorted belief system, what happens when one of these kids loses a spouse through death, are they expected to live the rest of their life as a widow or widower because they only have half a heart to give to a new mate. I'm guessing that Jim Boob would somehow justify moving on if Michelle died, but would probably brainwash his children from finding future happiness if they lose a spouse to death.

Anonymous said...

I'm still shaking my head at the food that was served at Jill's reception. To me,the strangest thing was the "root beer floats." I can't imagine anything as messy as that. Usually a wedding reception with cake & cokies will have punch. The Duggars are always having punch at birthday parties & baby showers. Also they just had the food sitting out there, nobody was serving it. It appears, that people were just grabbing at the cookies & cupcakes. Guess they observe the same unsafe habits that they do in their own home. People just sticking their hands in the huge bowls of unwrapped candy. I wonder how much they paid for these great wedding planners? Of course, the wedding planners were probably just more "friends" of the Duggars. Whenever they need anything at all done, they just happen to have friends that do that for a living. If it's construction,or they need a trainer for weigh loss,or a nurse for Josie, etc. They always have a close friend. The strange thing is, JB always needs to introduce himself & Michelle,to these very close friends

Anonymous said...

It's been a while since I've seen the episode where Jana talks about giving her special jewelry box to Jess, but if my memory serves me correctly, weren't they something like 7 and 4 years old at the time. Seems like the lessons they would have each learned are: Jessa--being a bratty little sister will get me special things as a bribe, and Jana, age 7--your feelings don't matter and you might as well learn that at an early age because it is your destiny to always be putting others first.

Reality TV Junkie said...

Regarding the jewelry box:

I really don't see the problem, they were acting just as Christians should, loving others and putting others before yourself. Christ says to love your enemies, in that time, Jessa was Jana's "enemy". Giving her the jewelry box showed her love for her sister. I do not see the problem with that act of giving.

Allison said...

I wonder how much they paid for these great wedding planners? Of course, the wedding planners were probably just more "friends" of the Duggars.

--

It was posted online that the wedding planners were Jill's friends who apparently offered to plan. And same with the girl who made the cake. Oh and I read on Chad Paine's blog that he was 2nd photographer for Jill's wedding, so I'm guessing the photographer was also a volunteer.

mom in texas said...

http://seewalds.com/marrying-young/#more-25

Link to an interesting blog post by Micheal Seewald, Ben's father. Any thoughts? I see this as a direct yet indirect challenge to the beliefs of the Duggars and other like-minded people. It is quite telling and really makes me wonder of he is hinting at something.

Andrea said...

Totally agree with the other commenter. The Seewald Family blog is a total dig at the Duggar family. There is no way Jessa and Ben's relationship is moving towards marriage, but maybe I'm wrong?!

http://seewalds.com/marrying-young/#more-25

Andrea said...

Agree with the other poster about Jinger looking really, really thin. She's starting to remind me of that women Sarah Mally, the writer of "Before you meet Prince Charming" I remember Sarah Mally appearing in an episode of 19 kids and counting and feeling really bad for her. Poor Jinger, hope this extreme weight loss is temporary . . .

Also, wanted to adding, going to a developing country and sitting around and painting the nails of the individuals you are there to serve is the ultimate in "salvation tourism." The developing world doesn't need manis and pedis they need Doctors, Nurses, engineers, business professionals and other skilled people to move away from poverty. The Duggars and others like them are totally clueless, they leaving feeling good about spreading the "work of god" the people they claimed to have served go back to their lives no further ahead.

Anonymous said...

As far as Mr. Seewald's long blog post goes, I'm reading into it that he thinks marrying young and quickly is a good thing because of sexual desires that crop up between the two. So, he thinks it's a good idea to marry someone just because you want to sleep with them? I think there are more important reasons to commit to someone other than finally being able to kiss them.
I know a few people who dated in the 1950s, where it was moreso the correct thing to "wait until after marriage", who while dated young, married for those same sexual reasons. After the excitement of the wedding, etc., was over, they endured many decades of unhappiness in a marriage they really didn't go into well prepared. Most of them divorced in the years later, wishing they had given themselves more time to grow up and experience life before marriage.
In this archaic courting system the couple aren't even allowed to be alone with each other to even talk in private, eye to eye. You really marry a stranger.

Another thing that is annoying to me: how can Jill and Derick be qualified to speak about anything regarding marriage and relationships? They have only been together for 5 months, three of those months never being able to be alone? Are they experts on relationships? Jill certainly isn't. I wonder how WalMart feels about Derick needing so much time off for his "other job", co-star on a TV show? I'm sure his co-workers do not appreciate any inconvenience this causes them in the process.
I am also very glad that Derick's mother is better. I sincerely hope and pray that this lady is cured and enjoys many happy years with her sons and husband.

Judy said...

I notice that Anna is always things are "fun." That was fun, this is fun, this is going to be fun. She's also thankful a lot.

Anonymous said...

Looks like The Duggars church may be having some money woes following the big scandal. One of their main buildings is in my neighborhood in Nashville. It has a for sale sign out front. I actually had no idea what was going on there until I saw a ton of Duggar look a likes in the parking lot filling out of buses and passenger vans and I looked up the name on the sign.

Anonymous said...

Re Judy's post:
What else can Anna say? I don't think she is allowed to use any other words, other than "blessed".
She doesn't have a very wide vocabulary and is still a little girl IMO. She married Josh at barely 20 yrs old with absolutely NO experience in the outside world. Sorry to say, that I don't think her parents were/are any intellectual giants either, to give their children much intellectual stimulation. I am sorry to say that about the Kellars, as I think they are probably nice people, especially Anna's mother. She is so shy and timid, it hurts me to watch her.

Anonymous said...

I'm sorry Reality TV Junkie, but you just don't teach a 3 & 7yr old how to be a good Christians, by forcing one to give up a prized possession. There are other ways to teach children to share. You can't behave that way out in the real world. You cannot just aggravate a person until they give up something that mean a great deal to them.

Lucy said...

Jill didn't even comfort her during the water birth when Anna was worried her baby would die from drowning in the water! No one took a darn minute to explain what happens during a water birth it seems. I'm not a fan of Anna's but her labors seem to be increasingly heart wrenching!

Anonymous said...

Re: The comment by Anonymous 8/11 @6:45am. You hit the nail on the head regarding the long ago problem Jana had with Jessa. It was just the way life was going to go for Jana in the future & of course it has.

Anonymous said...

why do the duggars go to central america to do mission work? seems they cannot help the people? seems it is only for show they go their. the other blog stated this. I feel sad for those children they really have no idea what is out in the world. their father or mother hold no kind of job and these kids will never have any kind of skill. this is really sad. I hope tlc will cancel this show.

Anonymous said...

The Duggars violated a basic principal of child rearing with the jewelry box incident. You should not reward bad behavior. Jessa should have lost a privilege instead of getting a gift.

hello said...

What's worse than the jewelry box incident is that they used blanket training as a way to get babies to obey. If that is not cruel, i don't know what is. Jimboob and Michelle have trained their kids since birth on what to think, how to feel and what to do. I have always wondered if Jana might have done something in her past that they deemed so sinful that she is doomed to spend the rest of her life in the Duggar compound with no chance of ever getting out.She always puts a smile on her face, but her eyes always look sad. She spends all of her time being a sister/mom and is not being encouraged to either find a career or get married. I believe she only pretended to want to be a doula so she could go along with Jill as an accountability partner.

Anonymous said...

Hi capslock! I saw that too and was deeply disturbed by the many parallels between the FLDS and what we've seen and learned about Duggarland. The FLDS women wear identical prairie dresses and their hair is always long and done up looking like something from the 1800's. The Duggar women all wear the same style, overly conservative skirts & modest polo shirts and the hair is long and curly. When looking at them from behind or from a distance it's often hard to tell who is who. The women in both groups are programmed to always obey, to never question and never say no to their male headship. Even the boys are to obey without question. Sound familiar? The side by side portraits of Warren Jeffs and his father with the words "stay sweet forevermore" underneath were especially creepy as we've often heard Michelle use the same term. The only real difference I could see was that FLDS allows multiple wives therefore producing even more children and JB has just one broodmare/wife. It really makes one wonder what we AREN'T seeing. So many sad parallels.

Wednesday said...

I'm sorry but I don't feel sorry for Anna and her labors. She is a grown woman who has given birth three times. If she is too mentally impaired to research how to approach a labor and delivery then she should not be reproducing. She should have known that when she felt like she needed to have a bowel movement then it was time to push out that baby, not sit on the toilet. She should have read up on water births to know what to expect before she went into that tub. She needs to be accountable for herself and her children. She seems to have the mentality of a 13 year old girl who may know the basics but needs a parent to tell her what to do to guide her through rough patches. What would happen if she knows something is wrong during labor but Josh disagrees? How would she feel if something happened because she didn't open her mouth except to utter a prayer?

Anonymous said...

Josh is at it again:

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/08/11/reality-tv-star-josh-duggar-warns-conservative-christians-of-obamas-gay-friendly-agenda/

Nancy Ann said...

I agree with Wednesday. Time for Anna and the adult offspring of Jim Bob and Michelle to step up to the plate and take control of their own lives. They are not children anymore. If they want a different life then they need to take the bull by the horns. Of course it would be difficult because of the opposition from their parents, but it's a free country and they are legally adults. Jim Bob and Michelle could shame them and even shun them, but that is really the extent of their power. I am not convinced that they have set aside individual accounts for the the children, so I doubt they would lose money in that way. Other people would gladly step in to help them. All they would need to do would be to hook up with a non-Gothard church and the people there would support them.

Anonymous said...

Maybe Anna has finaly spoken up and put her foot down about having another baby. After Michaels' birth on the toilet and Marcus' water birth which scared her half to death, maybe she finally stood up to Josh and said enough is enough. Otherwise, she probably would have conceived by now, Marcus is over a year old.

Anonymous said...

Anna had two years between Michael and Marcus so if she's going to continue that way it's only now time for her to conceive again.

Judy said...

I'm sure Anna is not stopping another pregnancy. she has stated many times that she does not intend to. It seems like she gets pregnant when each child is about a year, so she is probably pregnant or about to be. And Jill probably is or about to be, too. No rest for the weary.

Anonymous said...

I just can't get past this "baby a year" mentality with these people. It's just awful. I can't believe that Derick would think that it's "great" that they would have a child this soon into their marriage. They aren't even out the gate yet in life. I hope Jill can find something else to occupy her free time with and grow up some herself before she has any children. Also, money doesn't grow on trees. I think it would be a hardship on Derick who has bore the brunt of these financial changes in their lives.
As for Anna, she doesn't have a real clue at all. Has she ever balanced a checkbook? Probably not, just assumes that "it" will always be there for her to spend when she needs/wants to. She has physically changed so much since she was 20 it's pathetic.She seems to be having a difficult time with the kids, and household she has already.

Missy said...

I've always thought that it's a huge waste of money for the Duggars to make these trips to South America. Giving out candy to children with teeth that are rotting & no access to a dentist. Doing manicures & pedicures. I remember some of the people appearing frightened when JB was yelling at the top of his lungs in what he considers his great command of the Spanish language: "Gringos, Grande Festiva." The man who is the missionary there all the time (can't remember his name)kept trying to get JB under control as he knew the people were apprehensive, but JB was sure everyone wanted to listen to what he had to say, even though it made no sense. He has access to every new technology available & yet he won't be considerate enough to learn just few words of the language. For God's sake, use the money to be of real help It isn't like the attention they bring to these people ends up really being helpful to them. It hasn't help out with the situation with th orphanages. Both JB & Michelle made a trip there with Gill & Kelly to meet with the president & discuss the needs of the orphans. Of course, JB & Michelle had to rush home, as Josie, their own frail infant had been rushed to the hospital with a seizure. They never accomplish anything & the money spent on these trips is what could really help these people.

Anonymous said...

Anna's physical appearance has changed drastically in the last 5 years. Has Joshua even noticed the toll her pregnancies have taken on her body in such a short time?

Wednesday said...

Just saw a picture of Jessa and Ben holding up passports for their trip to Central America. To me Jessa looks very old in the picture. If I saw her on the street I would guess her to be closer to 30.

Anonymous said...

Today there was a repeat of when JB & Michelle, went on a marriage retreat to Puerto Rico. Strangely,it was only the two of them with another couple leading the retreat. I always believed, a marriage retreat, involved a number of couples, usually meeting together in groups, discussing various issues & how to resolve them. However for JB & Michelle, it was only the two of them,& it seemed more like just a vacation in Puerto Rico for them. When asked what they hoped to get out of the retreat, JB answered immediately," number 20." When they went snorkeling, JB had on cut off jeans & Michelle had on a dress. JB made the comment;"this is the first time Michelle & I's have gone snorkeling." He didn't say, "Michelle & I," he said Michelle & I's, using plural form. It never ceases to amaze me about their poor command of the English Language & yet they home school their kids. I often wonder, if some of the things they say are just a regional way of speaking? The kids were at home with grandma, & when they were cleaning up, before their parents came home Jackson said, "I really don't like clean to up. Hannie immediately replied very defiantly; "so do I!" I thought, good for you Hannie, keep up with that attitude!.

Nancy Ann said...

Yes, I saw the article about Josh's rant against gay Americans. How is it that HGTV takes the Benham brothers off the air for saying terrible things about gay people and A&E takes the crazy Robertson guy off the air (at least temporarily) for bashing gay people, but TLC just ignores it and goes on with 19 Kids? I sent TLC another email asking them to remove at least Josh from their network.

Anonymous said...

Almost all of the Duggar grammar fail is attributed to just that bad grammar whether from ignorance or not caring, I can't say. While there is a higher percentage of people with bad grammar in their part of the country, most of the people do speak English correctly. I have relatives who live there and the Duggars would fall into one of the bottom two percentiles.

Anonymous said...

Can't help but wonder who wrote Josh's speech., he certainly didn't write it himself. When is TLC going to get a clue about how dangerous these people & their agenda are? He's definitely laying the ground to run for political office. Anyone doubt that?

Anonymous said...

Without a doubt, Josh did not write any of that speech. I would bet a dollar against a doughnut that it was written by speechwriters and that he was coached multiple times on how to give it in the way that political candidates are prepared for debates. Josh has never had an original thought that I've ever heard and I doubt he has much skill as a writer either. I recall when Michael was born, Josh spelled his name on Instagram as "Micheal." It was corrected after two days as someone must have called it to his attention. It's easy for a casual writer to reverse those two letters, but not when it's your own child's name unless your education is woefully inadequate.

Judy said...

Anna's body has changed because she's gained a lot of weight, as has Josh. She's only had three pregnancies and she's young. It will be much worse in ten years when she's had 5-6 more kids.

I don't think she deliberately wants 1 child a year; I think they just try to get pregnant all the time and by the time she's not nursing so much, she gets pregnant again.

Judy said...

I just saw my first commercial for the new season. Let's rejoice that Jill and Derrick can touch more now.

Lucy said...

Really?
I hope someone else can confirm this. My family is still heavily involved in the IBLP and the last I heard is that they were either at Big Sandy or the Nashville Training Center (it's not a church but another IBLP property).
I'm just trying to gather facts and any information I can. My sisters will no longer reply to my text messages.
I'm worried. Because even though they say Gothard is gone, I've come across photos of him in homes of the people who work at IBLP HQ. People I know my sisters have spent time with.

Anonymous said...

I wonder if they are postponing Jessa's engagement until the end of the season because then they are guaranteed an additional season because everyone will want to see Jessa & Ben's wedding. One of their producers did say they are pretty tv savvy.

I've been watching some old episodes of the show and not once has Michelle iniciated a kiss with Jim Bob. Does she even like him? Or is this a part of the lifestyle they lead where your husband must start all things sexual? Or could it be his breath? I remember in an episode that she says he has always had problems with his breath.

Wednesday said...

I think its negligent for TLC to not acknowledge the behind the scenes political agenda of this family. Disgusting.

Anonymous said...

So I have seen several articles discussing "trouble in paradise" for Jill and Derick. Is any of this true I wonder? Several articles state that Jill and Derrick went through a rough patch in their marriage (married for what 7 weeks?) but are OK now.
Apparently Jill got mad when Derrick did not mow the lawn and then posted that Instagram picture of her brothers coming over to mow.
I bet Jill is finding that marriage is hard work and dedication. She married Derrick after knowing him 3-4 months.
Derrick is probably finding that Jill has the maturity level of a 14 year old who has never been out of Daddy's control. I also wonder if he is not as on board with being on the show as Jill is. Jill probably thinks she and Derrick will just pick up where Josh and Anna left off and tag along with the family like Josh and Anna.
Derrick could also be under alot of stress. His mom is sick and it is stressful to have a family member sick with cancer.

Anonymous said...

"Wednesday, 8/13" I agree with you. It is clear that this family is moving in another direction than they started out; or maybe it was their intention from the start. Learning about their lifestyle is one thing, but pushing their agenda forward is NOT why we watch this odd family.
Frankly, I don't care who they want to vote for. They should do it NOT on their TV show. Not interested in hearing ALL 21 of them state who their political candidate of choice is, heck most of them aren't old enough to even vote yet.
It's time for the Duggars to shut up or really face and answer the truly hard questions on live TV, unrehearsed, not given the questions beforehand.

Elspeth said...

The trouble in paradise articles are made up tabloid nonsense to attract clicks. It's sole foundation is Jill posting a photo of three of her brothers who came over and mowed the yard while they were there. Jill said nothing about being upset, needing her brothers' help, or any other issue.

Anonymous said...

I would like to know what the situation will be for Jill and Derick , re: the show. He has a real 9-5 job that he has to show up at for all 40 hours a week. Does Jill realize that they won't be available like Josh and Anna are? That I Josh's "other job', as we know. Derick doesn't have time for such nonsense, but to tape some interviews and footage on a Saturday. Doesn't leave this guy much time to unwind after work does it? How about hanging out with some of his college buddies? Is Jill up for that? Maybe they will go to a sports bar and order beer? How will she react to even one beer being enjoyed in her presence? These are some of the things we would like to find out. How will mama and pops feel about that?

Canadian Fan Losing Interest said...

No matter what our age, as newlyweds we can have difficulties with expectations. I got married a week after Jill. He and I are both in our late 30s marrying for the 1st time. I automatically set aside certain tasks for my husband that my dad always did at our house. I think Jill has a lot of expectations (maybe JB & Michelle do also) that Derrick is just an add-on and that "one big happy family" life will continue like always.

mom in texas said...

The trouble in paradise articles are made up tabloid nonsense to attract clicks....
__________________________________
Agreed. But I do wonder if the Duggars feel it's necessary to send the unmarried kids to the married sibling's home? As a new married couple I am pretty sure they need and want some alone time. After 20+ years of sharing her space with dozens of other people, I am sure Jill doesn't mind staying home alone while Derick is out. Knowing Jim Bob and Michelle's twisted logic, they probably sent the brothers over there to make sure Jill is being accountable, in her own home no less, and not doing something wicked such as watching television or reading a book other than the Bible.

Wednesday said...

I don't think that Derick is the go to a bar and order a beer kind of guy. He passed Jim Bob's screening test, and was off on a religious mission. He was attracted to Jill because of her lifestyle and what she represnts. He I think he is a conservative Christian that just happened to go to a university. Do we know which school he attended? I think the money he can receive from the Duggar gravy train will override any common sense.

Anonymous said...

Does anyone know what Ben's new job is and that in fact he is working for Jim Bob? How is leaving is home where I assume he was not paying rent and where he had a job a smart thing to do? Just to be closer to Jessa? Unless of course he is living rent free or very low rent in his and Jessa's future home? I thought they frowned upon men living on their own? I don't think Josh moved into Grandma's house until right before he and Anna got married.

Anonymous said...

I agree that Josh did not write that speech. He was definitely coached big time. He waited at certain points for what was referred to as "thunderous applauses." Does Josh have a GED? I only ask, because recently, in one of Michelle's blogs, she said the children take an exam for the State of Arkansas when they finish their homeschooling. However she said a GED is not required by their state, but sometimes she takes the children to take the GED exam, as she feels it's a good thing for them to have. No kidding.

Anonymous said...

I really don't believe there is trouble in paradise with Jill & Derick over mowing the lawn. Don't forget the way she was raised, if the husband only wants to mow the lawn once a year, that's entirely up to him. After all, Derick is the head of the house. Jill knows better than to step out of line.

Beth Anne said...

I, too, worry that Derrick will lose some of his individual identity by being sucked into the Duggar Family vortex. They are all about them, them, them and "Look at what a big family we are!" Taking front stage at the airport with their size and bulk upon Derrick's return, with his poor stepdad and brother pushed to the back, and JimBob and Michelle never thought to instruct Jill that maybe it would be polite, kind, and appropriate for her to share the spotlight and think of his family's feelings. The entire Duggar clan seems to enjoy throwing their weight and clout around, despite Michelle's baby/keep sweet voice.

I agree that Derrick's conservative mindset aligns fairly well with the Duggar's mindset and religious views. Still, he has lived a less parent-conrolled live and I hope he and Jill are able to carve out a common ground whereby he still has attachments to his pre-Jill friends and his family and they spend an "appropriate" amount of time with the Duggars, but don't allow JimBob to dictate everything or have Jill being still attached to the hip of her parents and siblings at every turn.

Allison said...

Josh has mentioned that he has his GED.

I saw the new promo pic of the season and they have Mackynzie back with the little girls in the line up, not with her parent and brothers! I feel like they are trying desperately to incorporate her as the 20th child. Ugh.

Allison said...

I think some people give too much credence to Derick having gone to a university and having a real degree. That doesn't necessarily mean he doesn't have very conservative views. I don't think he would have pursued Jill if he didn't like what he saw from her family and their philosophies. I also don't think Jim Bob would have let Jill anywhere near Derick if he thought Derick would undermine how they raised Jill to act and think. I think he's a nice guy and seems more pleasant that Ben who just drives me up the wall (Ben reminds me soooo much of Josh... thinks he's way funnier and clever than he really is). But that doesn't mean philosophically he's different and that they are suddenly going to be normal. I think people are going to be really disappointed if that's their attitude going into the new season.

Anonymous said...

I also saw the new promo picture of the kids and it's weird. I guess Jill and Derick are the focus of the season so that's why they are in front. Then Josh & Anna with Michael & Marcus then all the older boys then jessa & Ben then Jana and Jinger then younger boys then younger girls including Mack. I don't understand why it was in this order instead of birth order like they usually do.

Anonymous said...

Please jessa do not marry that dope!! he is immature and a hot head. His comments about catholics was just one more example of how poorly educated he is. I am not a catholic. But I do know something about the history of christianity. If it were not for catholics there would be no christianity. For almost 1500 years catholics were the only christians. Martin Luther was born a catholic. Ben should be thanking them instead of sharing a childish rant with the world. dump him. even by Duggar standards he is creepy.

Anonymous said...

Anyone else read Ben's love letter to Jessa, creepy.

Anonymous said...

Re: The new prmo picture. Why is Mack not with her parents & brothers? It makes no sense to put her with the other girls. She belongs with Josh's family not with the younger Duggar girls.She should have been put with her parents & 2 brothers

Anonymous said...

I'm sorry but I don't understand Judy's comment re: Anna. Saying, I don't think she deliberately wants a child every year, I think they just try to get pregnant all the time & by the time she not nursing, so much she gets pregnant again. That seems like a contradictory statement. If she really doesn't deliberately, want a child every year why would they try to get pregnant all the time?

Ginger said...

I'm really finding some of the younger Duggar boys rather obnoxious lately. Guess they've been on TV for most of their lives. See Michelle & JB , TV isn't good for your children. Jackson, & Jason in particular are just so hyper & wild & they think it's funny. Jedediah & Jeremiah seem a lot nicer & better behaved.

Anonymous said...

What makes everyone so sure that the Duggars disagree with Ben's catholic insults? Perhaps they agree with him. I, for one, think they agree with him whole heartedly. Shame on them. Their "love everyone" show is a farce.
Also, Derick has friends from college who are not as hard core as he is, religiously and socially. Perhaps HE would not order a beer at a nice sports bar with his friends while out watching the "game", but maybe his friends might. The scenario was brought up with this in mind and how would Jill react to being out at a sports bar with Derick's friends if his friends or one of them ordered a beer?

Anonymous said...

On the 19 kids and counting page on TLC.com Jessa and Ben as well as Jill and Derick now have separate headings that link to pictures and videos about their relationships. An engagement announcement is surely coming soon. No way TLC would add Ben to the cover photo on the fb page and add a Jessa and Ben section unless they were absolutely sure this relationship was gonna be permanent.

I remember there was talk at a photo shoot they did for People shortly after Josh and Anna got married about whether or not she should be in the photos. A lot has changed since then

Ashleigh said...

Can someone link me to the new promo pic?

Anonymous said...

In a repeat this morning, it was just prior to when Anna gave birth to Marcus. She sent Josh to the store for shoes for Mack & Mike. She asked if she should write downd the sizes but Josh was insulted & said he could at least remember that. However, she also told him to keep the kids in the stroller as that would be the easiest way. He never even brought the stroller in the store, so of course the kids were running allover the store. Michelle saw a small red car & Josh took it down for him to play with. Of course, the shoe shopping became a problem. Michael would not give up the car & wouldn't let Mack even have a turn. That didn't seem to be an issue for Josh. Anna blamed herself as she didn't write everything down word for word. Later when they went shopping for a home in DC & they were looking at various houses & townhouses. Josh actually made the remark to the realtor, when looking at some of the townhouses; "our kids don't keep normal hours & that might be a problem with the neighbors." What children age of 2 or 4 don't keep regular hours? It was obvious he was referring to the fact that the kids stay up very late at night & I will never understand that. Don't these parents of now 3 kids realize children need sleep? I don't care what went on in the SR Duggar home, this is now your life. Please set a schedule for your kids bedtime!

Stephanie said...

Jessa and Ben are officially engaged. He's still nineteen and she's spouting off to People magazine that they are going to havr as many kids as possible and adopt too!

I understand getting married too young because your faith tells you to marry before physically intimacy, (I did that and the guilt of fooling around is like a ton of bricks) but the lots of kids announcement kind of surprised me.
Let them kiss, hold hands, hug, and be in a car and go to a restaurant ALONE.

My daughter is starting 10th grade and we are wrestling with the fact that boys can now drive and car dating is around the corner. It isscary but I would NEVER take that away from her. Baby steps with car dating. Think about it Ben and Jessa have NEVER SAT IN A CAR ALONE!!!

mom in texas said...

According to people.com, Ben proposed to Jessa last night. So there was something to Ben moving to be closer to the Duggars. Also now, Ben's dad's blog makes more sense. He was trying to get ahead of the criticism before the announcement.

taurus0385 said...

So Jessa and Ben are engaged according to Facebook.......

Csnee317 said...

Jessa and Ben are officially engaged as of last night. People magazine has the story. Ugh. I really do not care for Ben in the least.

mom in texas said...

Yesterday I watched the episode where Josh and Anna discussed with their respective parents' the then potential move to D.C. It was a stark difference between Jim Bob's reaction (Michelle never said much of anything) vs. Mr. and Mrs. Keller's very supportive response. Jim Bob said something along the lines of "This is a huge decision to make....You will be moving thousands of miles away from family...and we won't get to see the grand kids much..." Has Jim Bob every considered that Anna did exactly that when she married Josh?! She moved away, thousands of miles from her family and her kids never see their OTHER grand parents. It made me angry to see how controlling and unsupportive Jim Bob and Michelle were. However, Anna's parents were very open and honest with how they felt and never once did they discuss how it affects their feelings, only how it will help Josh and Anna. Anna even got in a small, discreet dig when she said, alone (well alone on camera; not sure how alone she really was), during her interview how the talk with HER parents went GREAT.

Watching this episode and then hearing about Ben's move and then proposal made me wonder about something. Maybe Jim Bob will not approve a courtship with a guy unless he 1) lives in the NW Arkansas area or 2)is willing to move to the NW Arkansas area. I truly believe that Jim Bob wants and needs to have ultimate control over his "19 kids" so that they can continue this dog & pony show. So maybe Jana hasn't been approved to court because none of her suitors have been willing to go along with the Jim Bob plan. Even though Josh and Anna moved, they are still incorporated in the show and drag along for appearances. with Josh courting Anna long distance it was different because they knew she would move where he was because he is the "headship" which means every Duggar daughter will be expected to do the same. Poor Jana may actually only be seek long distance courtships and none are passing the Jim Bob test. This man is a tyrant. Why would anyone spends years raising kids and then not want to let them go? The point is we raise our children to the best of our abilities and then we let them go into the world to be functional adults. Not over grown latch-key kids who still need the watchful eye of daddy and mommy.

Anonymous said...

It's official Jessa and Ben are engaged.
http://www.people.com/people/mobile/article/0,,20843769,00.html?hootPostID=8b95753bf62735058308661e3c2557d7

Anonymous said...

It must be so hard for Jill to see her husband off to work each morning (if she does) since she is used to waking up at noon and having her schedule her way.....I bet she is having a hard time adjusting to a normal 8-5 work schedule with only weekends off.

Reality TV Junkie said...

"If she really doesn't deliberately, want a child every year why would they try to get pregnant all the time?"

If they try to get pregnant right after nursing is done, probably 1 year, it will be almost another year until there is another baby, making a baby every other year, not every single year. Seems to be what they're doing.

mom in texas said...

In the video on people.com that accompanies the Ben and Jessa announcement, the family is shown doing a photo shoot. In once scene the family is all pretending to play instruments, one of the boys (James, maybe) is sort of dancing while playing his guitar. I wonder where he would have even known to do that since the Duggars don't dance and supposedly don't have exposure to dancing. It goes to show that if dancing and musical talent is in your blood, you can't fight it. This kid presumably shouldn't know or understand moving to the rhythm but he does it. Jim Bob and Michelle are really stifling their children's true talents in life with all the rules and restrictions.

Anonymous said...

Am I the only one who thinks that Ben and Jessa are actually married already? Jessa would not just call herself "jessaseewald" if she weren't actually Jessa Seewald. That is not like them. Jill didn't do that...My guess is the kids couldn't wait any longer, and ran off and got married. I think they ran off; but for the tv show they are faking that they got "engaged" for ratings sake..."faking" is actually called, "LYING"! One of the top ten commandments and the thing God hates...I think God would be more honored by following His clearly stated, written commandments, than by insisting on having all the children one can possibly have! Tell the truth Duggars. Honor God, not TLC contracts. Fear God, not lawyers.

Allison said...

Am I the only one who thinks that Ben and Jessa are actually married already? Jessa would not just call herself "jessaseewald" if she weren't actually Jessa Seewald. That is not like them. Jill didn't do that...My guess is the kids couldn't wait any longer, and ran off and got married. I think they ran off; but for the tv show they are faking that they got "engaged" for ratings sake..."faking" is actually called, "LYING"! One of the top ten commandments and the thing God hates...I think God would be more honored by following His clearly stated, written commandments, than by insisting on having all the children one can possibly have! Tell the truth Duggars. Honor God, not TLC contracts. Fear God, not lawyers.

--

Jill became Jill Dillard on Twitter before they got married. I'm not sure if Jill was already engaged when she started that Twitter account, but if you go to twitter.com/jillmdillard, you'll see that she was using well before the wedding. That was about the time that Jessa created her Twitter handle as Jessa Seewald as well.

Allison said...



In the video on people.com that accompanies the Ben and Jessa announcement, the family is shown doing a photo shoot. In once scene the family is all pretending to play instruments, one of the boys (James, maybe) is sort of dancing while playing his guitar. I wonder where he would have even known to do that since the Duggars don't dance and supposedly don't have exposure to dancing. It goes to show that if dancing and musical talent is in your blood, you can't fight it. This kid presumably shouldn't know or understand moving to the rhythm but he does it. Jim Bob and Michelle are really stifling their children's true talents in life with all the rules and restrictions.

---

These kids are sheltered, not stupid. If you remember, they went to a Moroccan restaurant in DC where they saw some dancing (one of the little girls was sort of wiggling) and that's when Jim Bob shared about their conviction not to dance. They have also been to gospel churches where there is clapping and dancing. They have also seen a Broadway show (Mary Poppins). These kids might be discouraged from certain things but that doesn't mean they don't even know what they are. That's ridiculous. These kids aren't housebound. They've traveled the world -- I'm sure they've had plenty of opportunities to see people dancing.

Kerstin said...

I don't think that they have married already. As someone pointed out - it's probable they have been engaged for quite some time. I also believe that Jill's instagram name had been dillard before the wedding.

Beth Anne said...

I think the whole "Mack is counted in with her same-age girl cousins" thing is indicative of the lack of boundaries that exist in that family i.e., Josh is not a "true" grownup with his own family, but merely an extension of JimBob's earthly kingdom. Sure, every grandparent sees their grandchildren as an extension of their family, but the Duggars take it to a whole new level.

The same is true with the point some other posters have brought up about the any of the suitors the girls have probably need to come into the Duggar fold, both by physically moving closer to the JimBob/Michelle compound and also ensuring their actions and statements align with the Duggar way. So disturbing on so many levels!

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